It is currently Wed Apr 29, 2026 2:42 pm



Post new topic Reply to topic Go to page Previous  1, 2

Do you believe the 40 cal/cm^2 NFPA 70E informational note should be deleted?
Yes 53%  53%  [ 32 ]
No 47%  47%  [ 28 ]
Total votes : 60
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: NFPA 70E 40 cal/^cm2 informational note
PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2014 12:30 pm 
Plasma Level
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:08 am
Posts: 2178
Location: North Carolina
Larry Stutts wrote:
Leonard wrote:
Hi JIm

Greetings from Canada. Being the President of a local electrical contractors chapter, I am very often confronted by fellow electricians on simply the term cal/cm2. This is not exactly a familiar term to allot of electricians in oppose to temperature in either degrees C or F scales. Now when we throw the 40 cal/cm2 at them it can become more confusing. If I have it correctly the term cal/cm2 goes back to the Alice Stoll experiments in the late 1950's and early 1960's? Regarding the "more emphasis on de energizing". I agree and like the comment above that, is that not what NFPA 70E and CSA Z462 are all about? De energizing as the first choice. If the 40 cal/cm2 is going to remain in both standards, perhaps we should focus our efforts on inserting some information in an annex on conversions to PSI or other terms that are more familiar to the maintenance worker. Some real to life examples of how much energy 40 cal/cm2 really is and why it is so dangerous. Something similar to as what we know that 1.2 cal/cm2 for 1 second is the same as holding your finger an inch away from the hottest part of the flame of a cigarette lighter.


Leonard,

There is a chart I use in presentations to put it in perspective:

1.0 cal/cm2 = Equivalent to a finger tip exposed to a cigarette lighter flame for one second
1.2 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly cause 2nd degree burns to bare skin
4.0 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly ignite a cotton shirt
8.0 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly cause incurable 3rd degree burns to bare skin


A bit off. 1.2 is the amount of energy required for 2nd degree burns in 1 second. Longer exposures go up to about 2 cal. The cutoff for cotton clothing is 1.2 cal, not 4. It chars, not burning. Need more data for autoignition. What is missing here is heat is not temperature. Third degree...no data on that at all. The only thing magical about 4 vs. 8 cal is calculating working distances with respect to the head, and that chemically treated 12 oz. Cotton is usually rated to around 8-10 cal.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: NFPA 70E 40 cal/^cm2 informational note
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:14 am 
Sparks Level
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2009 5:00 pm
Posts: 271
Location: Toronto
Larry Stutts wrote:
Leonard wrote:
There is a chart I use in presentations to put it in perspective:

1.0 cal/cm2 = Equivalent to a finger tip exposed to a cigarette lighter flame for one second
1.2 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly cause 2nd degree burns to bare skin
4.0 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly ignite a cotton shirt
8.0 cal/cm2 = Amount of energy that will instantly cause incurable 3rd degree burns to bare skin


I noticed missing per second notation in your chart. Namely, units of measurement in the chart should read cal/cm2*sec. Indeed, the 1.2 cal/cm2 should be delivered within one (1) second time interval to cause 2nd degree to bare skin. The same amount of energy but delivered over longer than 1 second time interval won't cause the damage. For example, 1.2 cal/cm2 is the amount of incident energy delivered by exposure to sunshine for within one (1) minute. Please note that a fraction of 1.2 cal/cm2 exposure is required to cause the damage when delivered within shorter than 1 second time interval. Check please this forum thread at http://arcflashforum.brainfiller.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=2221 for more information.

On the same note, the NFPA 70E informational note of 130.7 is meaningless without reference to time taken to delivery the 40 cal/cm2 energy. That is to say, any material and bare skin will stand 40cal/cm2 exposure when the dose is administered within long enough time interval.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 7 hours


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
© 2022-2025 Arcflash Forum / Brainfiller, Inc. | P.O. Box 12024 | Scottsdale, AZ 85267 USA | 800-874-8883